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  1. Page created, but author did not leave any comments.

    Anonymous

    v1, current

    • CommentRowNumber2.
    • CommentAuthorGuest
    • CommentTimeAug 23rd 2022

    These are just called categories in

    • Benedikt Ahrens, Peter LeFanu Lumsdaine, Displayed Categories, (arXiv:1705.04296)
    • CommentRowNumber3.
    • CommentAuthorMike Shulman
    • CommentTimeAug 29th 2022

    I don’t think a set-theoretic definition of this can say “for each object” in defining the hom-sets and so on. Without the type-theoretic language, you have to be explicit about having a fibration over the space of objects with essentially discrete fibers, etc.

    I would probably suggest to not give an explicit “set-theoretic” definition at all, but just point to something like Segal space.

  2. adding the other definition of precategory with only one set of morphisms

    Anonymous

    diff, v2, current

    • CommentRowNumber5.
    • CommentAuthorMike Shulman
    • CommentTimeAug 30th 2022

    Sorry, this is also wrong. The type A,B:Ob(C)Hom(A,B)\sum_{A,B:Ob(C)} Hom(A,B) of all morphisms in a precategory is not generally a set. Whoever you are, Anonymous, you may want to back off a bit and stick to edits that you understand well.

    • CommentRowNumber6.
    • CommentAuthorMike Shulman
    • CommentTimeAug 30th 2022

    Removed incorrect definitions in set theory and with one set of morphisms. Added some more explanation in the Idea and Remarks sections.

    diff, v3, current

  3. draft definition of a precategory object in a (2,1)-topos

    Anonymous

    diff, v4, current

    • CommentRowNumber8.
    • CommentAuthorGuest
    • CommentTimeAug 30th 2022

    What kind of mathematical object is a precategory?

    If we are in homotopy type theory, which has univalence and is though to be the internal language of an (,1)(\infty,1)-topos, and the interpretation of the precategory definition in simplicial sets is a particular kind of Segal space with homotopically discrete homs, then the definition inside of a (2,1)(2,1)-topos doesn’t really define a precategory. One should really be defining it inside of an (,1)(\infty,1)-topos, paralleling the definition of an internal (,1)(\infty,1)-category in the article category object in an (infinity,1)-category.

    Otherwise, it doesn’t make sense to solely restrict to homotopy type theory, since the type theory definition given above in the homotopy type theory section is also valid in other models of type theory such as Thomas Streicher’s groupoid model of types which do not have univalence, and it doesn’t really make sense to talk about the (,2)(\infinity,2)-category of precategories either, as there are many inequivalent such (,2)(\infinity,2)-categories depending upon the model of type theory.

    • CommentRowNumber9.
    • CommentAuthorGuest
    • CommentTimeAug 30th 2022

    There are at least two possible notions of “precategory” that one could define in mathematics: there is a type theoretic notion in line with wild category, and there is an (,1)(\infinity,1)-categorical notion in line with H-category object in an (infinity,1)-category. These two concepts are defined in the same way in (the infinity-groupoid interpretation of) homotopy type theory but differ in other type theories: In an extensional type theory or a type theory where all types are nn-truncated, such that types cannot be interpreted as infinity-groupoids, an H-category whose hom-infinity-groupoids are 0-truncated is not the same as a wild category whose hom-types are sets.

    • CommentRowNumber10.
    • CommentAuthorMike Shulman
    • CommentTimeAug 30th 2022

    Agreed. I have reverted the last couple of edits. This notion of “precategory” is a type-theoretic notion. The corresponding notions in various kinds of toposes and categories have different names.

    I also added a note that, as Guest pointed out, precategories don’t require univalence but make sense in arbitrary intensional type theory.

    • CommentRowNumber11.
    • CommentAuthorMike Shulman
    • CommentTimeAug 30th 2022

    Anonymous, if you’re reading this, please don’t mix type-theoretic definitions with their semantics in higher categories. We have separate pages for category and internal category, and for group and group object, and so on, even though the latter is the internalization of the former by interpreting a definition in some suitable internal logic. A page precategory should be about the direct definition in type theory; its internalization in some model could be an “internal precategory”, although since there is already the term Segal space it doesn’t seem necessary to introduce a new one.

  4. removed mention of infinity-groupoid from disambiguation header since precategory is a type theory concept, not an infinity-groupoid theory concept, and not all types model infinity-groupoids in all type theories.

    Anonymous

    diff, v7, current

    • CommentRowNumber13.
    • CommentAuthorHurkyl
    • CommentTimeAug 31st 2022
    • (edited Aug 31st 2022)

    FWIW, the term “precategory” appears in the nLab elsewhere – at category object in an (infinity,1)-category the term “internal precategory” refers to a segal space object. E.g. the 1-category Cat is the category of internal precategories in Set. There to the terminology is used to reserve “category” to mean including the additional assumption of Rezk completeness.

    And recall that the category of segal space objects in Gpd\infty Gpd can also be described as the category of \infty-categories equipped with an essentially surjective functor from an \infty-category.

  5. Quick question, what should a topos without Rezk completion be called in HoTT? It can’t be called “pretopos” because that name is already taken.

    • CommentRowNumber15.
    • CommentAuthorMike Shulman
    • CommentTimeSep 15th 2022

    I would probably call it something like a “precategory topos” or “topos precategory”.

  6. Adding section describing precategories whose homs are setoids (i.e. types with an equivalence relation / sets without Rezk completion) rather than sets, and how the two notions coincide in any univalent type theory due to the univalence axiom.

    Anonymous

    diff, v11, current

    • CommentRowNumber17.
    • CommentAuthorGuest
    • CommentTimeSep 18th 2022

    The added definition defines a (2, 1)-preorder (equivalently, a locally setoidal prebicategory); I think we should only use the term ’precategory’ for the locally univalent (2,1)-preorders (equivalently, a locally 0-truncated prebicategory) and move the other definition to its own page on (2, 1)-preorders.

    • CommentRowNumber18.
    • CommentAuthorGuest
    • CommentTimeSep 18th 2022

    @17

    On the contrary, I think the term ’category’ or ’precategory’ should refer to the notion whose homs are setoids. This is because in set theories of both the material and the structural flavour, equality of elements in a set and thus in hom-sets of a category is defined as an equivalence relation, and thus when interpreting propositions as types one should similarly lift the equality equivalence relation to setoid structure. Furthermore, most of category theory still makes sense when using setoids rather than sets, and the definition using setoids is more general. One then speaks of locally univalent categories and globally univalent categories, and univalent categories being those which are both locally univalent and globally univalent, with the caveat in that all categories in a univalent universe are locally univalent. The definition using setoids also generalizes better to higher category theory since the additional structure is already there.

    • CommentRowNumber19.
    • CommentAuthorGuest
    • CommentTimeSep 19th 2022

    The hom-setoid precategories behaves differently than the hom-set precategories. For example, for the definition of a functor between precategories, the functions F a,b:Hom A(a,b)Hom B(F Ob(a),f Ob(b))F_{a, b}:Hom_A(a, b) \to Hom_B(F_Ob(a), f_Ob(b)) for objects a:Ob(A)a:Ob(A) and b:Ob(A)b:Ob(A) of the functor F:ABF:A \to B have to be strongly extensional if the hom-types are setoids, while the functions only have to be extensional if the hom-types are sets (function extensionality follows from univalence or having an interval type).

    • CommentRowNumber20.
    • CommentAuthorGuest
    • CommentTimeSep 19th 2022

    The problem here is that one really needs a concept of (n,k)(n, k)-preorder as distinct from (n1,k)(n - 1, k)-(pre)category in a general intensional type theory, because of the lack of 0-truncation at the (n1)(n - 1)-morphism level (the preorder level) in the definition of a (n,k)(n, k)-preorder, and the lack of univalence in a general intensional type theory which implies that all preorders are posets and thus 0-truncated.

    • CommentRowNumber21.
    • CommentAuthorGuest
    • CommentTimeSep 19th 2022

    I think composition of morphisms also has to be strongly extensional for the setoid definition to work. And agreed that the setoid definition should go on its own page.

  7. moved added section w/different definition to (2,1)-preorder and left a comment on this article stating that the locally univalent (2,1)-preorders are the precategories.

    Anonymous

    diff, v13, current

    • CommentRowNumber23.
    • CommentAuthorGuest
    • CommentTimeSep 19th 2022

    strongly extensional means “preserving an apartness relation”, what we are looking for here is “preserving the equivalence relation”.

    • CommentRowNumber24.
    • CommentAuthorGuest
    • CommentTimeSep 19th 2022

    From the nLab article on equivalence relation:

    A set equipped with an equivalence relation is sometimes called a setoid, although at other times that term is used for a pseudo-equivalence relation instead. This terminology is particularly common in foundations of mathematics where quotient sets don’t always exist and the above equivalence to a set cannot be carried out. However, arguably this is a terminological mismatch, and such people should say ‘set’ where they say ‘setoid’ and something else (such as ‘preset’, ‘type’, or ‘completely presented set’) where they say ‘set’. (See Bishop set and page 9 of these lecture notes.)

    The homotopy type theory community uses terms differently from other parts of mathematics. In homotopy type theory, a set is a 0-truncated type, and a setoid is a type with an equivalence relation, and a univalent setoid as a setoid which satisfies a Rezk completion condition and thus equivalent to a set, so there are really just setoids and sets.

    To reflect usage elsewhere (such as set theory), one really should be talking about 0-truncated types as being 0-truncated, a set as a type with an equivalence relation, and a univalent set as a set which satisfies Rezk completeness and thus equivalent to a 0-truncated type, so there are really just sets and univalent sets.

    Similarly with (2, 1)-preorder/precategory/category vs category/locally univalent category/univalent category, etc.

    • CommentRowNumber25.
    • CommentAuthorGuest
    • CommentTimeSep 19th 2022

    A set equipped with an equivalence relation is sometimes called a setoid, although at other times that term is used for a pseudo-equivalence relation instead.

    Is a setoid a type with an equivalence relation, or a set with an equivalence relation? Those two things are different in intensional type theory, in the same way a type with a preorder is different from a proset, and preceding discussion seems to imply that a setoid isn’t 0-truncated.

    • CommentRowNumber26.
    • CommentAuthorGuest
    • CommentTimeSep 19th 2022

    Setoids are thin pregroupoids so one could call a 0-truncated setoid a strict setoid.

    • CommentRowNumber27.
    • CommentAuthorGuest
    • CommentTimeSep 19th 2022

    Similarly to the case with ’category’, the term ’set’ is overloaded. One should use ’h-set’ for a 0-truncated type and ’Bishop set’/’setoid’ for a type with a prop-valued equivalence relation to avoid confusion.

  8. removed incorrect statement that (2, 1)-preorders are precategories in homotopy type theory

    Anonymous

    diff, v15, current

    • CommentRowNumber29.
    • CommentAuthorMike Shulman
    • CommentTimeSep 26th 2022

    In the context of homotopy type theory, it is proper to use the word “set” for a 0-type, because that is the correct notion of set in that foundational system. It’s reasonable to emphasize this by saying “h-set” or “0-type” at the first usage in a particular context, but thereafter it is okay to revert to “set”.

    A setoid in intensional type theory does not generally refer to a type with a prop-valued equivalence relation, but a type-valued one. I don’t know of any evidence for the claim in #24 that this is any different in homotopy type theory.